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Post by Richard W on May 29, 2014 12:44:02 GMT -5
Well, that one certainly stuck. I love the melding of country/soul/rock on that single ballad.
I'm surprised their aren't more covers of it. Or am I?
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Post by Dianna on May 29, 2014 14:46:50 GMT -5
well I personally like miss musgraves.. she's young and fresh..interesting to watch. her songs are catchy and she's pretty. I like her too, and if I'm not mistaken, she co-wrote that song with Brandy Clark and Mac Mac. There seems to be a lot of committee songwriting in Nashville these days, but this particular group is breaking away from the trucks/drinking&partying topics. Apparently I was mistaken--- not Mac Mac but Shane Mac. Yes.she's one of the girls to look out for. From what I understand she has won some pretty impressive awards too.Her music is more traditional sounding but her lyrics are well "edgy". I just hope she doesn't get mixed up in all that tabloid nonsense. |
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Post by Michael Dennis on May 29, 2014 15:33:39 GMT -5
I haven't found one but long time Linda fan Trisha Yearwood does it justice... Outstanding; close your eyes rather than look at Trisha and you can see the influence of Linda...IMHO. |
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Post by sliderocker on May 29, 2014 15:45:59 GMT -5
But anyway... Try Me Again is a fabulous song, and not just because Linda wrote it. This is proven when the song is filtered through someone else, in this instance, Yearwood. Essentially stripped of the single Linda connection (the album version), the song stands on its own very sturdy legs and boy, does it give a singer something to work with! But what I wouldn't give to hear Linda interpreting her own song (is that possible?) live, broken out of the studio confines and set loose. "Try Me Again" was proof Linda could write a song and demonstrated an unrealized potential she should've been encouraged to keep doing more of, but regretfully, it was something she didn't do on a regular basis. It would've been interesting to have seen what else she could've done as a songwriter with a substantial number of writing credits as opposed to the very few songwriting credits that she has. But, songwriting did seem to be something she didn't believe she could do on a regular basis. Maybe she had a tougher time of it coming up with a melody as I recall she told Rolling Stone the lyrics for TMA came out of her rather quickly. I would love to have heard Linda perform TMA live although in the late 70s, it might've been hard for her to have done the song live with any kind of justice. Many artists in the 70s used synthesizers in place of actual horns, strings and woodwinds but on some songs, it didn't come off so well. Some of the synthesized strings for instance sounded more like flutes. In the 70s, I'd rather have heard TMA with real strings as opposed to synthesized strings although later synthsizers sounded more genuine. As for Trisha's version of TMA, she did a good job of it and in choosing a song Linda wrote, Linda does receive royalties for those performances. Not as much as what she could get from any artist recording and releasing the song on a million selling album. It's a pity of the artists who have covered Linda, very few of them opted for songs on which she had a writing credit but again, that's not a large catalog. |
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Post by erik on May 29, 2014 17:30:44 GMT -5
Quote by sliderocker:
I think a lot of this is true. My feeling is that songwriting was an area in which she lacked the confidence to do this with any kind of regularity, that she couldn't "measure up" to those around her. She once even rationalized that she'd "hate to add to the ever-increasing pile of bad songs." But even if "Try Me Again" was something of an extreme freak of nature, Linda still wrote lyrics that had emotion, heart, and a mind. Most of what we have to put up with on the radio isn't even a thousandth as good as this one song by itself. Insofar as Trisha's version of it goes, because her version did appear on an album (2000's Real Live Woman) that did in fact sell beyond Platinum status, Linda probably earned a fair amount of royalties; and I do believe she complimented Trisha's recording of it.
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Post by sliderocker on May 29, 2014 19:27:07 GMT -5
I think a lot of this is true. My feeling is that songwriting was an area in which she lacked the confidence to do this with any kind of regularity, that she couldn't "measure up" to those around her. She once even rationalized that she'd "hate to add to the ever-increasing pile of bad songs." But even if "Try Me Again" was something of an extreme freak of nature, Linda still wrote lyrics that had emotion, heart, and a mind. Most of what we have to put up with on the radio isn't even a thousandth as good as this one song by itself. Insofar as Trisha's version of it goes, because her version did appear on an album (2000's Real Live Woman) that did in fact sell beyond Platinum status, Linda probably earned a fair amount of royalties; and I do believe she complimented Trisha's recording of it. Part of the problem I think with Linda as a songwriter was that she hung around with people she considered good songwriters, but although she said she'd "hate to add to the ever-increasing pile of bad songs," that's something she couldn't have known for sure if she didn't at least try on a regular basis. I feel the people around her who were known for their songwriting, Jackson Browne and J. D. Souther, would've encouraged her to go for it. Same for Andrew Gold and Kenny Edwards. Even if she thought her songs were bad by comparison, that wouldn't have meant the public or the critics would've thought the same. Of course, Linda has always been her own harshest critic, harder on herself than what others have been. What might have helped in building Linda's skill as a songwriter would've been having her work with others and having those songwriters give her encouragement. I'll always believe she could've succeeded beyond her wildest dreams as a songwriter, if she had given it more effort. But, I'll always wonder if she did try and maybe the others around her told her her efforts were no good? Again, you can't know something was bad if you didn't try your hand at it.. |
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Post by Dianna on May 29, 2014 20:23:19 GMT -5
I'm not sure where I read or heard Linda talk about songwriting Didn't she simply feel there was so much writing talent around her she didn't feel the need to. She has joked how Jackson Browne and or J.D. were song hoarders ha.. i can imagine their generosity to Linda which may have resulted in encouragement to write her own lol.
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Post by sliderocker on May 29, 2014 21:03:39 GMT -5
I'm not sure where I read or heard Linda talk about songwriting Didn't she simply feel there was so much writing talent around her she didn't feel the need to. She has joked how Jackson Browne and or J.D. were song hoarders ha.. i can imagine their generosity to Linda which may have resulted in encouragement to write her own lol. I think she did say there was so much writing talent around that she didn't feel the need to write, and she did talk about Jackson and J.D. hoarding - or holding back songs for their own albums. She also said songwriting was not a gift she had, and it's possible she may have had struggled with writing "Try Me Again," the one song she did write by herself. Linda should've been encouraged to have tried her hand at writing more songs, and she may have been given more encouragement. But, what if instead of encouragement, she was told what songs she did come up with were no good? That could've explained her lack of confidence and maybe kept any songs written by her off her albums. |
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Post by erik on May 29, 2014 21:20:50 GMT -5
Quote by sliderocker:
Given that she had the kinds of friends who rooted for her, I think it's a stretch to say that they ever would have discouraged her from writing. It's more likely that it was her own self-doubts that stopped her from going much further in this area. And as I've said, just on the basis of "Try Me Again", I can't conceive of her ever writing or even co-writing a bad song.
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Post by sliderocker on May 29, 2014 23:50:03 GMT -5
Given that she had the kinds of friends who rooted for her, I think it's a stretch to say that they ever would have discouraged her from writing. It's more likely that it was her own self-doubts that stopped her from going much further in this area. And as I've said, just on the basis of "Try Me Again", I can't conceive of her ever writing or even co-writing a bad song. If Linda was ever discouraged, I don't think any of that discouragement would've come from her friends. More like the behind the scenes people at the record company. The record business can be pretty brutal with creative individuals, all because the name of the game is - or was - write a hit song, sell a lot of records and more importantly, make the record company a lot of money. That can be detrimental to the singer, musician or songwriter as record companies tend to want to go back to the same source that achieved the hit record originally. If a song isn't up to their standards, it may not even be released on an album. As it relates to Linda and songwriting, because Linda's success had come from songs written by others or remakes of rock oldies, I could see her record possibly company discouraging her from writing her own songs, even after writing "Try Me Again." I couldn't see her writing or cowriting a bad song either. She did say she chose the songs she recorded and presumably, if she had written a song she wanted to record, I don't think the record company would've said no to her. I do think they probably would've wanted her to have stayed in the same groove she was in because that was a winning groove, but at the same time, Linda demonstrated a knack for writing a song with a good melody and good lyrical content, that it would've been all the more surprising if her record company didn't ask her to write a few more songs for her albums, eventually with the view of getting her to record all Ronstadt originals and moving her away from the remakes. |
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Post by erik on May 30, 2014 9:27:02 GMT -5
Even record company discouragement is a bit hard to imagine, because when she was signed to Asylum in 1972, Linda was in the hands of folks like David Geffen who encouraged artistic growth of any kind because they believed that this was the way to be a success. If Linda was itching to write some of her own material, I don't think anyone in the Asylum hierarchy would have stopped her. Everyone knew her to be a very articulate and intelligent lady. Again, I think it was her own insecurity that stopped her, but I don't think she can be criticized for feeling that way.
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Post by POP80 on May 30, 2014 10:58:29 GMT -5
If Linda was itching to write some of her own material, I don't think anyone in the Asylum hierarchy would have stopped her. Everyone knew her be a very articulate and intelligent lady. Again, I think it was her own insecurity that stopped her, but I don't think she can be criticized for feeling that way.
It's also my impression that Linda did not have a burning desire to write her own material. I get the feeling that "Try Me Again" emanated from a particularly emotional place and was part of the healing process for her regarding this relationship. There's little doubt about her capability to write -- after all, one well-written song and one well-written book is not too shabby.
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Post by sliderocker on May 30, 2014 11:16:16 GMT -5
Even record company discouragement is a bit hard to imagine, because when she was signed to Asylum in 1972, Linda was in the hands of folks like David Geffen who encouraged artistic growth of any kind because they believed that this was the way to be a success. If Linda was itching to write some of her own material, I don't think anyone in the Asylum hierarchy would have stopped her. Everyone knew her to be a very articulate and intelligent lady. Again, I think it was her own insecurity that stopped her, but I don't think she can be criticized for feeling that way. Asylum, possibly not, but as it became part of the Warners group, that label itself once cared more about the music than the money vut in the 70s that shifted to being more about the money, so they might have put some pressure on Asylum to focus more on the hits and less on the artistic freedom and growth. Still, one assumes that Asylum operated independently without pressure from Warners or Atlantic (another label which cared more about the music initially than the money). just as Warners and Atlantic were run without interference, but all those companies under that corporate umbrella had someone they were accountable to. Linda's own insecurity may have been what held her back from writing more songs, but did that mean she didn't try writing more songs? Or could she have written more songs (that we're not aware of) but she just didn't record them because of that insecurity? And that she didn't record them because she just didn't think they were good enough? Again, she couldn't have written songs that would've "added to that ever increasing list of bad songs" without first trying to write them, but she shouldn't be criticized for not writing on a regular basis. Songwriting, like writing stories or scripts require a lot of discipline to sit down and actually do. Songwriting also requires more discipline because of having to work within the rules of music. Some have no problem doing that on a regular basis but for any singer with a record contract in the 70s, record companies wanted new product every year if possible, and most songwriters didn't write any of their songs in a single day. That would've been more of an exception rather than the rule. What was more surprising was the artists or bands who wrote songs being able to gather up enough songs in time to make up an album. Needing time to write more songs is probably why certain artists who can write songs take two to three years (or longer) between albums, along with the pressure from the record companies of coming up with hits. It's not easy. |
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Post by Dianna on May 30, 2014 11:46:38 GMT -5
If Linda was itching to write some of her own material, I don't think anyone in the Asylum hierarchy would have stopped her. Everyone knew her be a very articulate and intelligent lady. Again, I think it was her own insecurity that stopped her, but I don't think she can be criticized for feeling that way.
It's also my impression that Linda did not have a burning desire to write her own material. I get the feeling that "Try Me Again" emanated from a particularly emotional place and was part of the healing process for her regarding this relationship. There's little doubt about her capability to write -- after all, one well-written song and one well-written book is not too shabby. bingo... I feel the same thing. If she didn't have the confidence she would have bluntly said so. Linda is never one to mince words. She wrote some good songs. winter light is my favorite.. I don't know if she wrote on her own but I think it one of the most beautiful and haunting songs I've ever heard. |
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Post by Richard W on May 30, 2014 13:17:22 GMT -5
Harper Lee only wrote one book.
Just sayin'.
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Post by Richard W on May 30, 2014 13:18:28 GMT -5
I didn't like Winter Light at first. Too Enya-esque for my tastes.
But it grew on me, and I agree, Dianna, it's a gorgeous song.
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Post by sliderocker on May 30, 2014 14:44:13 GMT -5
I didn't like Winter Light at first. Too Enya-esque for my tastes. But it grew on me, and I agree, Dianna, it's a gorgeous song. I was hooked on "Winter Light" the first time I heard it, and yes, it did sound Enya-esque, but I like Enya's music too. But, as Linda was one of three writers on "Winter Light," I'm guessing her contribution to the song may have been writing part of the lyrics. I always thought it should've been a single, much more than "Heartbeats Accelerating," which still strikes me as not being one of Linda's finer moments. |
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Post by POP80 on May 30, 2014 20:34:36 GMT -5
Harper Lee only wrote one book.
Just sayin'.
Yes, and that's my favorite book of all time.
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Post by erik on May 30, 2014 21:50:05 GMT -5
Quote by Richard W re. "Winter Light":
I liked it a lot, though I can see why others might not, at first anyway. Linda was getting into vocal layering, and there's an unusually heavy emphasis on synthesizers on the song, which I can see would bug some. But it is a beautiful and poignant song, to be sure.
And as we may want to remember, she did write some more: "Lo Siento Mi Vida" (with her father Gilbert, and Kenny Edwards, the first flaring of her Mexican heritage, but in a country-rock context); "I Want A Horse" (with Wendy Waldman, for the album Sesame Streeet: In Harmony); and her own arrangements of the traditional folk ballads "I Never Will Marry" and "Old Paint".
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Post by Richard W on May 31, 2014 9:50:54 GMT -5
Harper Lee only wrote one book.
Just sayin'.Yes, and that's my favorite book of all time. Mine, too. Well, one of them, the others being In Cold Blood, and Huckleberry Finn. Those three books are the ones I re-read every other year or so, touchstones you might say. Three perfect works of art. As a song, "Try Me Again" is perfection and it's a pity more people don't know of it. |
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Post by POP80 on May 31, 2014 15:15:48 GMT -5
As a song, "Try Me Again" is perfection and it's a pity more people don't know of it.
Agree 100% about that! It's an exclusive category of "songs to slit your wrists by" (LOL) because it's so powerful and heart wrenching. We've all felt that way at one time or another.
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Post by suzannes on May 31, 2014 16:54:58 GMT -5
I think she stated in an interview once that she couldn't sing Try Me Again live because it was way too personal a song for her. Totally understandable! One of my favorites
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Post by POP80 on Jun 1, 2014 10:06:01 GMT -5
I think she also once said that she was embarrassed to admit that she ever felt that badly. She isn't one to share her emotions openly.
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Post by reel2014 on Jun 16, 2014 2:01:19 GMT -5
Try Me Again and Down So Low are on my top 5 faves to sing of Linda's...I've always said that "Down So Low" was a precursor to Whitney Houston-isms!
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Post by erik on Jun 16, 2014 9:08:59 GMT -5
Quote by Reel2014:
Well they are still among her all-time best, that's for sure. I suppose I differ, though, in thinking that the vocal power she demonstrated on those songs necessarily predates what Whitney Houston did. Linda was never as over-the-top as WH (in my opinion).
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Post by sliderocker on Jun 16, 2014 10:59:07 GMT -5
Well they are still among her all-time best, that's for sure. I suppose I differ, though, in thinking that the vocal power she demonstrated on those songs necessarily predates what Whitney Houston did. Linda was never as over-the-top as WH (in my opinion). Likewise, I feel Linda was as never over-the-top as what Whitney was but "Down So Low" was a total surprise coming from Linda, an artistic triumph in my opinion - more than the big band recordings or Mexican recordings. It was powerful. Her live version, missing the backing vocalists, was even more stunning. I'm surprised DSL wasn't used to close out the album. I think it would've made a good closer as fans would've had a "WTF was that?" moment. It would've blown their minds. |
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Post by eddiejinnj on Jun 16, 2014 12:38:01 GMT -5
they were spot on voting the whole album "best female pop" for that year!!!!! eddiejinnj
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Post by reel2014 on Jun 19, 2014 0:43:55 GMT -5
Linda is Nothing Like a Melissmatic Minstrel, ala Whitney,,, I'm talking P O W E R, as noted above, NO FEMALE E V E R gave us raw unadulterated POWER UNTIL Mamacita!! I'm holed up in an office building...I can't let it fly to record it right now....I have to be in a warehouse to do that song semi justice
My point is WHITNEY came with the Power...ala Melisma
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Post by philly on Jun 19, 2014 1:41:22 GMT -5
Quote by Reel2014: Well they are still among her all-time best, that's for sure. I suppose I differ, though, in thinking that the vocal power she demonstrated on those songs necessarily predates what Whitney Houston did. Linda was never as over-the-top as WH (in my opinion). I wanted to like WH, but it got to where I couldn't even finish listening to her songs...oh well, I tried  She was a great singer for sure, just not music to MY ears. |
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Post by Richard W on Jun 19, 2014 6:03:15 GMT -5
Whitney had a fabulous voice, I just didn't care much for her songs or her always over singing everything. I always thought it would be interesting to hear Whitney take on an album of Linda's, say Hasten Down the Wind, and sing songs outside of her pop/soul comfort zone and turn down the "fierce diva" dial. I mean, I imagine her singing Down So Low or Try Me Again more in Linda's vocal style but with Whitney's own instrument. I would imagine that would be one sweet album.
I mean, think of what Whitney's voice would sound like singing Linda's arrangement of Crazy--minus the vocal craziness that made so many of her songs sound hysterical to me.
Still, you can't deny Houston's gift.
But good grief, that live performance of Linda's of Down So Low (from Germany?) is just stunning. She digs deep and she delivers a payload, and is just as arresting to watch, even though her eyes remain closed through the entire song, as to listen to, so committed is she to the song. And it's not an easy song to sing, as I'm sure reel2014 can attest!
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She was a great singer for sure, just not music to MY ears.