What makes Linda tick

[richbaileyswifesue]

Page 134 in Simple Dreams about The Pirates of Penzance says it all:

First, the advice to Kevin Kline from co star Patricia Routledge about what they were trying to do with a scene: "We don't need to make it funny. We need to make it clear. If it is clear, then it will be funny."

And Linda translates that piece of advice into this:

" ... if one is singing a sad song, it is better to tell the story as clearly and simply--even as journalistically--as one can. It will have a stronger effect on the listener and seem more emotional than a teary, overwrought delivery."

That was an epiphany to me. Rich and I have been going back and forth about the "lack of emotion" in her writing, and I somewhat dismissed her interpretative abilities with songs because they seemed too academic, too pristine (especially the Great American Songbook songs). Now I get what she was trying to do. I think she succeeded in this book. Her matter-of-fact reporting of her musical life makes it more powerful to me, and she leaves it up to the reader to figure out how to respond to it. She is not manipulating the reader, she respects the reader and lets the reader decide. No wonder I find this book so refreshing!

I believe it's the same with the songs and I will have to go back now and listen again with that mindset, and I bet I will find out a lot of new things.

You can't really enjoy Simple Dreams without breaking outside box and entertaining other views of how someone should express their emotions about things. When you go with how Linda thinks (and I admit, she is wired differently than anyone I have ever met), then the book can become a revelation.

I've learned things about how I look at my musical career from looking at Linda's. Her story, so totally different from mine, shines a light on what I did right and what I did wrong and why she succeeded and I didn't. Too long and complex to go into here and there are no regrets on my end. Let's just say Linda succeeded because she was and is a true believer.

[Richard W]

Fascinating, Sue.

I've always admired Linda's way of singing the melody without embellishment. There's plenty of emotion in her singing, but -- to my untrained ear -- she utilizes the notes of the melody themselves to convey that emotion.

The one thing Linda doesn't seem to understand about her own voice is its unique "color", that ineffable quality that distinguishes her own instrument from all of those -- Lola Beltran, Emmylou Harris, Darlene Love -- that she so admires. I guess it's because it is her own voice that she can't hear it or even value it as much as we do. It's almost as if the singularity of her voice is inaudible to her.

[Deleted]

thanks.. nice insight into Kevin Kline, also..

[richbaileyswifesue]

Oct 2, 2013 10:52:42 GMT -5 Richard W said:

Fascinating, Sue.

I've always admired Linda's way of singing the melody without embellishment. There's plenty of emotion in her singing, but -- to my untrained ear -- she utilizes the notes of the melody themselves to convey that emotion.

The one thing Linda doesn't seem to understand about her own voice is its unique "color", that ineffable quality that distinguishes her own instrument from all of those -- Lola Beltran, Emmylou Harris, Darlene Love -- that she so admires. I guess it's because it is her own voice that she can't hear it or even value it as much as we do. It's almost as if the singularity of her voice is inaudible to her.

I bet that's so. Being a perfectionist, she wouldn't hear it. Too bad!

[Dianna]

It doesn't sound like Linda grew up with a lot of drama, she mentioned both of her parents were very calm by nature. Her mother in an accident crisis remained very matter of fact. Would Linda make a good 911 operator? lol.
What some people find interesting about certain artists like Janis or Jim Morrison, Cash and even Elvis is pain through living that we hear in their performances. I don't think Linda would ever be accused of being robotic or an ice queen.. she said she didn't feel comfortable doing those rock and roll songs or the image.. even tho she sang them great. I also feel to be authentic in what you do and not just an interpreter, there has to be a certain amount of believability through real life experiences that is put forth.. which is why she doesn't relate as much to rock n roll verses mariachi, standards or ballads. Maybe part of the reason the hall of fame keeps snubbing her.. meanwhile they choose people like GnR as soon as they become eligible.

[erik]

Quote by Richard W:

The one thing Linda doesn't seem to understand about her own voice is its unique "color", that ineffable quality that distinguishes her own instrument from all of those -- Lola Beltran, Emmylou Harris, Darlene Love -- that she so admires. I guess it's because it is her own voice that she can't hear it or even value it as much as we do. It's almost as if the singularity of her voice is inaudible to her.

Which is, of course, a touch sad. Alternately, though, Linda may feel that way because she isn't so full of herself (like a certain diva with the initials T.S. is [LOL]). In any case, so many of Linda's peers would probably do anything short of homicide to have even a small fraction of the vocal dexterity and control that she exhibited in her career.

[kgreen]

Linda's voice had "IT", whatever IT is that we can't define (same with her looks too, but that is a different topic). To my ears, the best voice I have ever heard live or recorded. I listen to Callas, Ella, Dusty, Streisand and hundreds of other great female singers who are just phenomenal and I always come back to Linda. Just something in her voice that can't be explained. I certainly am not expert enough to describe it as tone or color, etc....but she did everything and almost anything she wanted to with her instrument.

[cymru56]

Just a thought that we never hear our own voices as others hear us. How many times have we heard our recorded voice and remarked "that's not me - do I sound like that?"

[richbaileyswifesue]

Oct 5, 2013 11:17:23 GMT -5 kgreen said:

Linda's voice had "IT", whatever IT is that we can't define (same with her looks too, but that is a different topic). To my ears, the best voice I have ever heard live or recorded. I listen to Callas, Ella, Dusty, Streisand and hundreds of other great female singers who are just phenomenal and I always come back to Linda. Just something in her voice that can't be explained. I certainly am not expert enough to describe it as tone or color, etc....but she did everything and almost anything she wanted to with her instrument.

Linda's voice has a particular texture that is very pleasing to the ear. She rarely sounds shrill when she really belts it out; in fact, when I heard "I Keep It Hid" live, I got goosebumps! She held out that note twice as long as she did in the recording.

She also has just the right amount of vibranto, less at her peak than she had in the beginning. It's interesting because her training for Pirates required her to use the upper register and work the vibrato but it never made her chest voice heavy with vibrato, in fact, it had less! She learned to smooth it out through her training and smooth it was, like glass or chocolate syrup. :-)

I tried singing opera and could do it but it was wrecking my "other" voice for folk and pop. I didn't have the desire to commit to opera anyway so I gave it up. 

Linda had an extraordinary gift!

[erik]

Quote by richbaileyswifesue re. "I Keep It Hid":

Linda's voice has a particular texture that is very pleasing to the ear. She rarely sounds shrill when she really belts it out; in fact, when I heard "I Keep It Hid" live, I got goosebumps! She held out that note twice as long as she did in the recording.

I totally agree, having heard her do that song with that same sustained belting note on each of the three occasions I saw her here in Los Angeles. I think the reason she doesn't sound shrill when she belts is because she knows when to let it go, and why not every note has to be a Money Note. I really wish more of these overcooked diva hams out there would get the point.

[richbaileyswifesue]

Oct 6, 2013 13:00:06 GMT -5 erik said:

Quote by richbaileyswifesue re. "I Keep It Hid":

Linda's voice has a particular texture that is very pleasing to the ear. She rarely sounds shrill when she really belts it out; in fact, when I heard "I Keep It Hid" live, I got goosebumps! She held out that note twice as long as she did in the recording.

I totally agree, having heard her do that song with that same sustained belting note on each of the three occasions I saw her here in Los Angeles. I think the reason she doesn't sound shrill when she belts is because she knows when to let it go, and why not every note has to be a Money Note. I really wish more of these overcooked diva hams out there would get the point.

Totally agree!

[the Scribe]

I thought I would resurrect this thread as it has some wonderful insights especially pertinent right before the release of a documentary about Linda. Also happy birthday to Sue who seems to have done a "mind-meld" with Linda. A nice perspective. And hello to Charlotte wherever you are!

Sept 26, 2013 13:26:26 GMT -5 richbaileyswifesue said:

Sept 26, 2013 11:56:42 GMT -5 charlotte said:

m.journalstar.com/news/local/cindy-lange-kubick-linda-ronstadt-heart-like-an-unbroken-wheel/article_805cbe93-d598-5ab4-9899-df0d8cf2653d.html?mobile_touch=true

The sorrow and joy our girl is bringing to so many is fascinating. We of course have been there all along

Linda's been accused of not showing her emotions but she does, in her own way. Her emotions are hers and she protects them. The way she shows them is with the element of surprise. Like in her book, she'll write a long paragraph about something like her mother's paralysis at the beginning and sound quite matter-of-fact and academic about it, and then kill you with the last line. It's in that starkness that she reveals her feelings.

Linda is refreshing. She's not self-absorbed, she's not a drama queen, she's grateful for her life and her opportunities and she's humble about the privilege of working with so many people. She's all about community (notice how she's never alone in her book, always with a group somewhere whether it be family, friends, or band). She speaks matter-of-fact about everything, from the most trivial to the most devastating. That's why I really feel it when she blurts out that she can't knit anymore or how it's like Mt. Everest to brush her teeth. Ouch!

Isn't it refreshing that she's NOT like Lindsay Lohan, all the dirty laundry and the emotion strewn all over the street for the world to see and walk on? My admiration for her continues to grow.

ronstadt.proboards.com/thread/1592/thoughts-ronstadt-another-thoughtful-tribute

[the Scribe]

Linda Ronstadt Talks About Her Career and New Memoir

[the Scribe]

richbaileyswifesue:

Wow, Simple Dreams really starts cookin' when Linda gets into "Pirates of Penzance" and beyond! Her musical decisions never made sense to me as a listener but now that I know how she thinks, it makes perfect sense. There's such an uptick of passion, emotion and joy in her descriptions when she gets out of rock and roll and into her "true loves." We watched a bit of Pirates last night on Netflix and I found myself listening carefully, analyzing her performance now knowing the instruction that she got. Her voice was so beautifully flexible, just gliding over the notes, transitioning so smoothly between head and chest voice which I can tell you from experience is hard to do, especially where all her power lay in the chest voice. Sounds like she had a great teacher, it was a pleasure to listen. Now I want to do the same with the music I used to dismiss - Nelson Riddle and the Mexican music.

Her brief description of her mother's death brought me to tears, remembering my own mom. That paragraph was loaded with meaning if you read between the lines. The fact that her doll's clothes always hung on the line with her own meant that her mom appreciated the importance of Linda's doll and keeping the clothes clean. I'm getting choked up just thinking of that again. The best thing about a great mom are those little things they think of that are so precious to their kids. I get the feeling Linda's relationship with her mom was beyond words, into the sublime. Now I know that the Nelson Riddle music is a tribute of sorts to her mom, for passing down the love of those songs. And Nelson Riddle was thinking of his mom, recently deceased, when he worked on the Frank Sinatra album that Linda so loved. Don't you just love the synchronicity? :-)

Linda honored her mom through the Great American Songbook, and her dad through the Mexican songs. These were her most cherished accomplishments. Knowing the personal connection makes them all the most precious.

I SO get this book! I wish I could sit and chat with Linda about it, or at least write her an email.[/quote]

[the Scribe]

I always thought this particular article was one of the most interesting and telling.

Melancholy Baby
E s q u i r e, October 1985
by
R o n R o s e n b a u m

ronstadt-linda.com/artesq.htm

What is it about Linda? Where did she get this taste for melancholy? She paints for me a picture of childhood solitude and apartness, a time haunted by nightmares.

"I grew up about twenty miles outside Tucson, and at the time there wasn't a soul in sight. We lived on a dirt road with ten acres around us. I didn't go to kindergarten, so the first grade was a hell of a shock, because I didn't know any people that weren't related to me. So I was a loner. I've been this way ever since three. I find that a lot of people I know in the entertainment world like humanity in general but don't love individuals. I'm exactly the opposite. I think humanity is kind of horrendous but that some individuals are really nice. Basically, I like zebras better than humans," she says.

And then there were the nightmares.

"I can remember all the nightmares I had from the time I was a year old, " Linda tells me.

"From a year?" I ask skeptically.

"Yeah, a year and a year and a half old because I was in my crib, I know, and I know we got rid of my crib at a certain time."

They were terrifying nightmares, she says.

"I read that people that have a lot of nightmares are often creative, that the creativity becomes the escape valve for a lot of anxiety that you have that creates the nightmares. It's the only way your mind can take the pressure off itself. And I've always had nightmares since I was a child, and I did not have a particularly unhappy childhood."

Then what were the nightmares about?

She's reluctant to get too specific about it, but she says they began when her mother had to be taken to the hospital during an illness.

"They were mostly separation-anxiety dreams," she says, "nightmares about being separated from my parents. And I can remember them all absolutely vividly right now to this day, and I still have nightmares. I used to sleepwalk when I was a kid. I'm sure that's one of the reasons I have to sing- a need to compensate. If you're happy, you don't need to compensate."

I don't know why, but as she was talking about her nightmares I had a vision of Little Linda thrashing around in her crib in the grip of a terrifying separation-anxiety nightmare- and passing it on to us, distilling that terror over the loss of love in her heart over the years and pouring its sad elixir into corrosively sad songs. Songs about romantic separation and loss that have that nightmare edge of a loss beyond consolation; the dread that the hurt won't ever heal, that "a long, long time" means forever.

It has been said that the characteristic neurosis of the baby-boom generation is not the outmoded Oedipal complex but a wound in the psyche that begins earlier, is more deeply rooted: separation anxiety. Hooked on unprecedented love, attention, and Spockian indulgence, we're love junkies whose withdrawal symptoms are the pangs of separation anxiety. The killer sad songs that Linda Ronstadt has sung lock her childhood nightmares right into our grown-up ones.

While Linda's busy devouring her fish and my fries I take the opportunity to tell her my theory that contemporary killer sad songs serve the function of emotional catharsis that the nineteenth-century novel did for its mass audience.

Linda looks up to tell me that certain nineteenth-century novels have changed the way she looks at life.

"Madame Bovary and Anna Karenina- I learned so much about myself from those books. They were the most profound part of my growing experience...."

"You learned that...?"

"That I'm not alone in my predicament. That was an incredible revelation."

[Guest]

Absolutely one of the most insightful articles on Linda. Remember it well and have held on to the original. Required Ronstadt - perhaps the new film will touch on these aspects of her rich personality. Perhaps...

[the Scribe]

She's reluctant to get too specific about it, but she says they began when her mother had to be taken to the hospital during an illness.

"They were mostly separation-anxiety dreams," she says, "nightmares about being separated from my parents. And I can remember them all absolutely vividly right now to this day, and I still have nightmares. I used to sleepwalk when I was a kid. I'm sure that's one of the reasons I have to sing- a need to compensate. If you're happy, you don't need to compensate."

Other than the utter inhumanity of separating immigrant children from their parents perhaps this is why Linda has been so upset with DHS policies removing the children from parents. She can relate. I too had similar nightmares that my parents, especially my mom had died or gone away because she became a victim of polio (also a paralysis). I would sneak into their bedroom after each nightmare and watch to see if Mom was still breathing before sneaking back into my bedroom. Dad snored so I knew he was alive. When I read that about Linda I thought it was completely normal based on my experience and am thinking most kids have that anxiety? Maybe not.

[goldie]

" First, the advice to Kevin Kline from co star Patricia Routledge about what they were trying to do with a scene: "We don't need to make it funny. We need to make it clear. If it is clear, then it will be funny."

And Linda translates that piece of advice into this:

... if one is singing a sad song, it is better to tell the story as clearly and simply--even as journalistically--as one can. It will have a stronger effect on the listener and seem more emotional than a teary, overwrought delivery."

This ought to be applied to all the "over-souling" going on since Aretha Franklin perfected it. It is just too much and unfortunately became a standard others like Mariah tried to emulate. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't but mostly it is irritating. Whitney did it well but most others are without. Give me the clean, clear, crisp voice of a Linda Ronstadt or a Barbra Streisand that has emotion in their voice without resorting to vocal acrobatics. .

[erik]

Quote by goldie:

This ought to be applied to all the "over-souling" going on since Aretha Franklin perfected it. It is just too much and unfortunately became a standard others like Mariah tried to emulate. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't but mostly it is irritating. Whitney did it well but most others are without. Give me the clean, clear, crisp voice of a Linda Ronstadt or a Barbra Streisand that has emotion in their voice without resorting to vocal acrobatics.

Not only did this "over-souling" become the standard, it also became dreadfully boring in a hurry. It just became high-decibel warbling; and it was accelerated, in my opinion, by what was encouraged by the "judges" on American Idol, The Voice, and The X Factor.

In part, ironically, because of Linda, I have come to believe that not every female artist's voice necessarily has to be "perfect" to be soulful or have its own validity, nor do they have to make every note they do the proverbial "Money Note". There are quite a few Linda-influenced female singers of recent vintage who may not be possessed of the bigness, perfection, and control that Linda had, but who are absolute admirers of her approach--gals like Tift Merritt, Caitlin Rose, Margo Price, and Lindi Ortega, to name just four. Of course, the mainstream entertainment media will never tell you about them, because they want your eyeballs and ear lobes focused on Ariana, Cardi B, and T-Swift; but Tift and the others I've mentioned are out there for the discovering.

[the Scribe]

The excessive use of melisma in singing works well in Gregorian chants (which I love by the way) but I am not too crazy about the overuse of notes on one syllable in a song. It almost seems like cheating or overcompensation for lacking a voice. There are lots of singers that don't have great voices but have a pleasing sound and style. They would sound ridiculous oversouling and wisely don't.